Did you know about the rotten oils restaurants use in their fryers?
I've done it again. I ran my mouth when I should've kept quiet. I'm re-reading this post years later and feel bad, THIS is how I thought I'd get people on board??
I thought you'd like to hear about a phone conversation I had with a local chef…
It all began because Rami Nagel came to our local chapter to talk about his book, Cure Tooth Decay. Before the meeting, some of us on the local WAPF chapter board took he and his family out for dinner. His only request was a place with “good oils”. While we have some great restaurants here in Grand Rapids who source their produce, cheese, and meats from local farms that I love, and many also cook their stocks and other dishes from scratch, finding anyone who fries in a healthy cooking oil, like duck fat, lard, beef tallow, or even the refined (no-flavor) coconut oil, is proving to be nearly impossible. (Click those links for where I buy those healthy fats and click here for 4 keys to deep fried heaven for how to fry guilt-free!)
I googled “Grand Rapids duck fat french fries” (because I figured that was going to be my best bet vs. the other fats), and the first place I called went like this…
Me: “Do you still serve duck fat french fries?”
Chef: “No, we don't.”
Me: “That's too bad, why not?”
Chef: “Well, we never actually did, but we do serve frites!” (And he went on to tell me how they're made…)
Me: “That sounds great, but what do you fry them IN?”
Chef: “Soybean oil.”
Me: “Oh, shoot, I have a friend coming into town who is sensitive to soybean oil or other vegetable oils like that; no offense, but in my circles we call it ‘crap oil'.”
Chef: (After pausing, as if in shock…) “Well, I can't say as I'd call it that.”
Me: “Well, you probably just didn't know. But it's high in omega 6's and can cause heart disease, thyroid problems–soy isn't good for us at all. Have you ever searched online for, ‘Soy dangers'? Canola is just as bad. What real foodies want are healthy animal fats like duck fat or lard from pastured animals, beef tallow from grass-fed cows, pastured butter, and coconut oil. Even McDonald's used to only cook in beef tallow. Besides, animal fats are where the nutrients are.”
Chef: “People eating fried food aren't looking for nutrients.”
Me: “Actually, we are. I order grass-fed beef tallow right to my door in 5 gallon buckets so it's not as expensive as the smaller amounts. (Click here for where I get beef tallow at a great price. Or click here for the smaller size.) When I serve fried foods I feel great knowing it's from pastured animals and actually good for us–it's full of fat-soluble vitamins, CLA, omega-3's and other nutrients!”
Chef: “Well, we can't cater to such a small group of people. And especially when it's so much more expensive.” (He didn't say this in a snippy way at all, he was just explaining his dilemma.)
Me: “I understand, and keep in mind that this movement is actually growing, but just for your own cooking at home, you should try this stuff. It tastes great and it's good for you! I know I'm telling you something that's the opposite of what you hear in the mainstream, and most people are cooking with soybean oil in their restaurants, but hopefully I'm just planting a seed and maybe you'll be able do more research. Thanks anyway for your help!”
What do you think? Did I come off like the pathetic couple in this Portlandia video?! He really did seem to be listening, even though I could tell by his voice that he was hearing this stuff for the very first time, which is sad. We're making headway though in this movement to get the truth out!
I found one!
I'm not sure why I didn't just call Bistro Bella Vita in the first place. They've been great to us in the past. (Read about THIS yummy dinner we had there.) They said that they do have duck fat, butter and olive oil to use in any of their dishes and we'd just have to stay away from any fried foods (which they don't have a lot of on their menu anyway, but they don't have enough duck fat for a fryer). They also said they'd make sure that we didn't have to worry about any vegetable oils coming out to our table. Sweet!
Healthy Fats:
- Note that I haven't tried this, but look what I found: duck fat sold online! It's expensive so it would just be a once-in-a-while treat, but at least it's free shipping if you order over $25.
- Click here for where I get beef tallow. Or click here for the smaller size. Want to render it yourself? Click here for how to do it — it's not too difficult, but kind of a pain. I'd rather buy it, personally, especially after I priced it and found that it's cheaper to buy! 🙂
- More about the BEST deep frying oil
- Try some homemade Fast Food French Fries!
- All about Healthy Fats – Learn the Truth (A complete index)
- Again, click here for 4 keys to deep fried heaven 🙂
More on soy:
- Soy Protein Shakes, Almond Milk, and other Fake Foods People Think are Good for Them
- The Dangers of Soy
- Read Is Edamame Good for You?
- Try a Real Food protein shake to avoid powdered soy protein shakes
- “Are Meat Eaters Ruining the Earth?”
- Soy no longer the “darling” of the health food industry
photo, Creative Commons 2.0
Becky Zajac says
Hi Kelly-
What oil do you recommend for seasoning a carbon steel skillet at 400 degrees?
KitchenKop says
Hi Becky,
I use avocado oil that I got from Costco which has a 500* smoke-point. Just be sure to check your brand to make sure the smoke-point is high enough. 🙂
Hope that helps!
Kelly
Nancy Fisher says
I think it is really important to ask questions about the food at a restaurant and we shouldn’t feel bad about asking. I mean, we are putting this stuff into our bodies. I am surprised at how often my server does not know so many of the answers, like what fat is the food fried in?! The more people who ask and stop ordering food cooked in toxic oil, the sooner we’ll see some change.
Jean says
Do you know how difficult being a chef is? The long, relationship-killing, isolating hours? The amount of time you spend on your feet, managing your staff to maintain your standards and help them grow as cooks, all while making sure that the food is cheap enough for customers to want to buy it while being profitable enough to keep the door open so your staff can feed their families? The amount of passion, creativity, and craft you put into making the most tasty product you can to give people that a little bit of delight? Just a little reprieve in their tough days?
And then someone calls your food crap. To your face.
The margins in restaurant are tight. 33% fail within a year. 90% fail within 10.
That chef wasn’t being snippy with you because you were speaking appropriately, he was scared. Scared you’ll go on social media and badmouth him. Scared you’ll be the final straw that forces him to turn to his dishwasher and say “perdon señor, no mas trabajo” and watch the blood drain from his face as he desperately tries to calculate how he’s going to get another job quick enough to pay his rent.
No, you shouldn’t have told the chef his oil was “crap.” Your blog is crap, and I don’t even feel as bad as you should for saying so because the physical, monetary and emotional effort you put into this *total* is about 1/64th what that chef and his crew put into his restaurant every week.
Take your little self-satisfied rant and choke on it.
Danielle Levins says
No…I shouldn’t have called it that in front of my daughter…….because when she then asked the cashier about if they used “crap oils” I nearly melted into the floor, I was trying so hard to blend into that flooring and disappear!…… I’m pretty sure that was the last time I made that mistake too – right after I call something like that I always turn right around if the kids are with me and tell them what to call them, has become built in instinct. I only need to melt once in public thank you! LOL! But I’m with ya on this 😉 !
Norma Johnson Hilliard says
Good one Kelly! Also ask if the meat was factory farmed or free range. I hate going out to eat cuz I don’t know where the food is from. Is the fish from China! Ewww
Kelly the Kitchen Kop says
Yes Norma Johnson Hilliard — that’s always another question I ask, but I’ve mostly given up on finding pastured meats (OR healthy fats) so I just don’t ordered fried foods at restaurants (or rarely) and I don’t get meat much either. We have plenty of pastured meat at home so it’s no big deal, but once in a while if a restaurant has grass-fed burgers or something I get so excited!
Lori Nelson says
My favorite chef, Ember Alexis, knows and likes animal fats, coconut oil and good ole butter!
Laura Cullen says
ROTFL, “actually we are” That’s exactly right!
Wynonah Bates says
Thoughts on sunflower oil, Kelly the Kitchen Kop? Found it and thought it was an interesting drying option when I need to feel fry…
Kelly the Kitchen Kop says
I don’t use it @Wynonah — much better are the traditional, pastured fats mentioned in the post. 🙂
Leah E McCullough says
You are more tactful than me 🙂
Kathy Jenkins says
“Crap oil” is waaaaay too nice!!! And YESSSSS people who eat “fried” foods are so looking for nutrients!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Big time!
Tess Dicker says
I fry in lard at home. Tastes good better then plant oil
Tyra Droegemullr says
WE have a place near to me that sells duck fat fries! They are my fav!!!!!
Kelly the Kitchen Kop says
LUCKY!
Tyra Droegemullr says
Kelly the Kitchen Kop agreed!!!! Super yum!
Yvonne Kelley Gipson says
Love this conversation!
Michelle Maier says
“Actually, we are…”! Love it, even the shocked looks on faces of those who already know me when I tell them how much fried food I actually eat!
Tawnya Howell says
Places were forced to switch oils because everyone was told anil
Animal fat is bad.
Kelly the Kitchen Kop says
I know, no wonder people are confused @Tawnya!
Dani Kelley says
I’m going to open a restaurant called Duck Fat Fries. Actually, I was joking when I said it, but it sounds a bit intriguing!
Kelly the Kitchen Kop says
I’d totally go to your restaurant!
Dani Kelley says
I might have to hire you to do the PR work, Kelly–you know, dodging all the fake real foodies and having conversations such as above LOL!
Melissa Garrett-Mendoza says
In Knoxville, there is a restaurant known for frying their fries in duck fat.
Mary Eaton says
You tell ’em Kelly!
NancySue Lootens Reid says
Girl after my own heart!!!!!
Tim says
Oh boy… This article is hard to read with a straight face. “Healthy animal fats”… Ridiculous
Chad says
Are you kidding me? You are trying to pass fried foods as ‘healthy’ (facepalm). I am all into healthy fats, and the majority of my calories come from fats ie (coconut oil, olives, olive oil, avocado, nuts/seeds) but if you are think using a healthy oil to with high heat maintains its health properties I believe you are misinformed. I hope people dont start eating fried foods thinking it is ‘healthy’ because of the oil it is fried in.
Elaine says
Yes, Violet, please do your research, especially on canola oil – it is NOT a good fat!
Fr. K says
I love non hydrogenated, virgin or extra virgin coconut oil. I also use duck fat, but find it tastes much better if you render it yourself. Enjoyed the post!
Violet says
Actually, be careful with animal fat, it’s high in cholesterol. Cooking in avocado oil, olive oil, and coconut oil are the best oils. They’re still oil so moderation is best. They’re high in omega-3 which rocks. Olive oil tastes great on almost anything. Also, olive oil has some heat tolerance, so it’s ok to use in low-heat dishes. It’s better for you than butter on bread and flavoring foods already cooked. For baking, canola oil is best. Yes, it has omega-6 but we do need it. We just get too much in the American diet. If you don’t consume regular beef or things sweetened with corn syrup, you’re fine.
KitchenKop says
Hi Violet,
Have you read any of the posts at my Healthy Fats link? (https://kellythekitchenkop.com/2008/08/healthy-fats-oils.html)
Please do take a look, especially at the articles on cholesterol. Fats (and meat!) from pastured animals are loaded with nutrients and so good for us!
And Canola, oh my. It’s all genetically modified and is a modern super processed oil that I’ll *never* go near.
Take care,
Kelly
Jeanmarie says
Kelly, you were very gracious yet informative. Good on you!
norma tumberg says
Kelly, I think you did a great job of educating that poor chef. I hope he’s googling this out and educating himself more…….
Tasha says
Love you website Kelly!
I live in Canada, any idea where to buy it here?? The place you mentioned does not ship internationally..
I would love to try it!
KitchenKop says
Bummer, you may have to render it yourself!
Kel
Soli says
I think you did a good job with this. You didn’t get confrontational or condescending in your sharing of information. If only more people were willing to ask such questions and then plant seeds.
On the peanut oil, I discovered one of my favorite local places only uses it. While the food is amazing there, seeing that made me glad I don’t eat there often at all. I’d just feel bad for anyone with a peanut allergy wanting to eat there.
Alex Lewin says
Hahah Kelly, you are awesome! Good for you for educating this chef. It’s my sincere hope that you’ll call them back in six months or a year and they will have started using real fats for their frites…
AmanaonMaui says
The fryers at my culinary school used the “crap” oil. It was really disgusting looking actually. It was “semi-liquid shortening.” Somewhere between Crisco and liquid “vegetable” oil. It wasn’t even on anyone’s radar to use something different, especially when we were frying large quantities of food to serve in the college dining food court. It’s all about cost effectiveness, easiness, and what they’re used to. One of my instructors, who had been there for over twenty years, and who was a veteran chef trained at the Culinary Institute of America, didn’t know what was in his soup “base” (like a bouillon paste). I had to look at the label myself since I have celiac disease.
Lee says
I think you came off just fine. Hopefully, you did plant a seed. Btw I’m curious what you think of rice bran oil. Is it also a “crappy” oil?
[email protected] says
Kelly,
I put my foot in my mouth all the time but you are worse than me! Haha!
leah says
What about peanut oil? Whenever I find a really good grassfed burger place, I ask what they fry their fries in, and several times I’ve been proudly told peanut oil. Satisfied that it’s neither canola or soy I sometimes get them, but I wonder: is peanut oil a good oil for frying? What do you think?
AmanaonMaui says
It does have a high heat tolerance, so it won’t break down as badly as some oils for frying (e.g. olive oil). Degrading oils with high heat creates carcinogens. It always scares me when people fry with, or season their cast iron with, olive oil.
KitchenKop says
I’d say it’s fine for once in a while (and would eat fries at a restaurant fried in it), and it’s more traditional (which I trust more than the new oils) but it is high in omega 6, so that’s why it shouldn’t be used too often.
Kelly
Lianda says
Congratulations for opening the door to a discussion of healthy alternatives to Omega 6 oils.
The fact is, most people want to make healthy choices- but they have been misled by the FDA, false advertising and even the Heart Association (heart healthy diets??!!) that still insist on eating a low fat diet with vegetable oils.
Helping one person at a time is the way to change. The next big hurdle is getting people to understand that traditional dieting: Eat Less and Exercise More, is not just impossible, but actually LEADS to weight gain.
Good job Kelly!
Amanda Yoder says
I think you were gentle actually and gave him good information without being offensive! Good job. Much to my chagrin, as I’m allergic to pork products, many places in the deep south (SC and GA esp.) still use lard, just an FYI if you travel there. I’m interested if you’ve covered the olive oil dilema, since that was mentioned as an acceptable oil at the restaurant you found–as it’s only a healthy oil if it’s basically uncooked (goes rancid at somewhere very low like 200 mere degrees, and that’s only if it’s pure to begin with)….
KitchenKop says
Nope, I didn’t go there! But we’ll just be careful about what we order it on.
Kel
Elaine says
I also think you did great! I think you really did plant a seed – who knows if he’ll run with it. It always comes down to money. But you know I find I use “less” $ on fats because I incorporate bacon grease and that’s free. The rest of the time, I’m using lard from good farm animals so that’s really cheap too – I did render it myself – a pain but very easy.
AmanaonMaui says
Well, the bacon grease isn’t really free. You paid for the bacon, so the cost of it is built into the cost of the bacon. The restaurant chef can’t just go buy a bunch of bacon to get the grease.
Michelle Goldstein says
You did great Kelly!! We have same problem. SO hard to find good oil in restaurants, but I AM starting to ask and explain that I prefer butter and olive oil! It is hard to know how much to “share with others” in the effort to be helpful.
Donna Bauman says
You know what Kelly– you told the truth as you know it. It is hard to be the bearer of bad news but you were being honest and that is the harder walk to walk. Maybe you will have planted a seed for this chef in the future. I am amazed at how many “fancy” James Beard award winning places etc use “crap” oils. In my culinary training I have seen that for much of traditional “culinary education” there is no focus on the importance of oils. “Olive oil blend” with canola IS NOT the same as olive oil, Canola is terrible for the fryer (and anywhere) yet Canola oil is ALL over commercial food fryers– Chick Fil A even promotes… Now we have Canola Oil for our french fries! Ugh. It is hard to be the grim reaper on this but that is how change happens. So I say keep telling the truth Kelly! Tell it with compassion and kindness for we both know that we, too, once did not know these things. We strive not to pester or pummel folks with the information but simply to inform and then stand back and let people make their own choices and let them know why we might choose to eat somewhere else if they make choices we don’t like.
Becky says
Of course Bistro Bella Vita can accommodate you! They’re great 🙂 It makes me sad that the others couldn’t -I’m guessing you probably called some of my favorite places too. I say keep talking; keep doing what you’re doing and asking questions, teaching, etc. things are changing for the better pretty rapidly in GR- look at the turn out we had for the march against Monsanto! And no doubt we have one of the biggest and healthiest WAPF chapters in the state. 🙂 Wish I could be in town next week for the meeting! I’m working the 1st and 2nd, but looking forward to being home later in the day on the 2nd. High five Kelly! I’m proud to have you on my side and am thankful for your willingness to speak the truth boldly!
KitchenKop says
High five backatcha! 🙂
Allyson Bossie says
It’s so sad that people look at us like we are crazy to an extent. I can say this though: I have had the worst teeth my whole life even though I have done every single thing the dentist told me to do including regular cleanings and checkups. My teeth kept getting decay, my gums stayed swollen, painful, etc. I was in chronic pain with them for 2 years and finally started researching out of sheer desparation because the expensive solutions the dentist was doing and having me buy weren’t solving anything.
I changed my diet using all coconut oil, grass fed meat/fats, etc, and I threw out my toothpaste. That’s right, no toothpaste. I started with a glycerin free soap, and ended up using an essential oil blend to brush with. My gums are now pink, not bleeding, no pain, I can drink anything with ice in it, I don’t have to drink my coffee out of a straw. My teeth are better! I even have a small cavity that has remineralized a good half way (I keep taking pictures of the progress) while I wait for a doctor’s appointment to have it looked at! I can’t say I have lost weight as of yet, and I hope I do, but boy, just eating without crying is enough for me
KitchenKop says
That’s awesome Allyson!!!!
Kel
Suzanne says
I would have said the same thing to him. There are very few restaurants that still use the good oils. Even Indian restaurants have abandoned the use of coconut oil. Most of the time we just make it at home.
Renee says
I think you did great, too! Question about the beef tallow-how do you store it? The website recommended refrigeration & while I do fry a lot, it’d still take me a few months to burn through 5 gallons & I don’t yet have an extra refrigerator. I use real lard often & don’t refrigerate, but do keep in the coolest spot in my kitchen…any thoughts?
Thanks for all you do to promote real food awareness!
Kate @ Modern Alternative Mama says
From what I know, lard should be refrigerated but tallow doesn’t need to be. I’ve rendered and cooked with both.
KitchenKop says
I just answered that on Facebook too, so I’ll copy it here:
Good question, I was going to put this in the post but forgot. I split it into 5 one-gallon containers (from my coc. oil) and store it in the freezer. Actually Kent does it for me, it’s a messy job, but only needs to be done rarely. You could buy it in smaller containers but it’s more expensive. I keep it a couple years this way.
Kelly
Renee says
Thank you! Lard doesn’t have to be refrigerated for a good while. We used to keep a tin of home-rendered lard in the corner of our non-air-conditioned kitchen when I was a kid. Recently, a friend gave us some that she had stored in her smokehouse since Fall & is still in my pantry, but every time I use it, I make sure it’s not going “off”. It’s still perfect. I’ve never used tallow, but am dying to try it!
IC says
I think you did great!
Really makes me want to know where the Bistro chef went to school – could this be the difference in responses? Are there culinary schools that concentrate on traditional and tasty – which sure aint soybean oil – instead of current dietary guidelines? If you feel like asking, I’d love to know what the chef says!! Maybe some culinary schools have soybean oil sponsor infiltration the way med schools have big pharma?
KitchenKop says
That could be part of the difference, interesting! I’m guessing, though, that it just has a lot to do with the way the mainstream believes…