Vaccine Decisions

August 28, 2009 · 76 comments

vaccine Below you’ll find a list of all past posts on the vaccination issue. (More will be added later, I’m only just gettin’ goin’.)vaccine risks

And you may want to check out this DVD:  Vaccines: The Risks, The Benefits, The Choices.

Click here and scroll down to find the posts specifically on the flu shot and how to get out of a mandatory flu shot at your workplace.

But first, please read this important information:

Do not make your decisions about immunizations based on what you read here.  Take everything into consideration, yes, but do not rely totally only on what I share with you, because there is way too much that I don’t know.  I’ve done a good bit of research on this issue, enough that I can put a few sentences together and you may think I’ve got a solid handle on it, but I’m not even completely confident with our own decisions, let alone feeling OK about directing others – it’s all too confusing with valid arguments on each side to ever know for sure.  (I often think maybe we should’ve refused to have our kids get any vaccines after all.)  Use what you read here to motivate you to do more research on your own.  I’ll tell you what decisions we made after a LOT of reading and research, but do not blindly follow what we did.  Ask your doctor, read books, devour websites (Google “immunization safety” and you’ll have enough to keep you busy for hours), and get both sides of the argument so you can make an informed decision on what is best for your child and what sets right with you.  As with almost every topic, especially a hot one like this, there are just as many opinions “for” shots as there are “against”. I will not tell you what to do, and I wouldn’t want you to listen to me if I did – as I say all the time here on the blog:  doubt me!  Doubt everyone.  Ask questions.  This is your child. Even though it’s difficult and time-consuming, start the research process yourself. Let these posts be a starting point…

PAST POSTS ON VACCINATION DECISIONS

photo:  AJC1

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    { 72 comments… read them below or add one }

    1 Cara@ Health Home and Happiness August 28, 2009 at 8:30 am

    I really wish it was easier for parents to come up with non-drug-company-influenced information. My research (I was all for vaccines until this) consisted of statistics, I skipped almost all the opinions. Statically I couldn’t reasonably prove that vaccines helped more than they hurt. Yes, I could gather tons and tons of opinions on either side, but real case studies and numbers are what convinced me. (my children have never received vaccinations)

    Thanks for bringing up this subject! I too would love to cover it, but just don’t have the time to do it as throughly as I think it needs to be done.

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    2 Betsy August 28, 2009 at 8:50 am

    Cara, I read an anecdote on my fitness forum the other day that would tend to support your research. A woman said that her four kids were sick and she suspected whooping cough. She doesn’t vaccinate, so this was not a shock to her. A woman down the street from her has kids who also have whooping cough – and they’re vaccinated! Things that make you go hmmm, eh?

    The doctors told her it was post-nasal drip. Oy. They wouldn’t even entertain the possibility of whooping cough until she told them that other kids in the extended family had tested positive. They had just returned from a family reunion.

    I’m glad I don’t have to worry about this now; my only child is 37! When he was a baby I vaccinated without a thought. But there were fewer vaccinations then. I don’t know about the crap they add.

    I do worry about the H1N1 vaccine, though, and hope that they don’t try to make it mandatory. They’ll have to drag me kicking and screaming to jail first.

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    3 Beth August 28, 2009 at 11:16 am

    Kelly,

    I’m in such a quandry with my about-to-turn-14 yr old. She hasn’t caught chicken pox naturally because everyone is getting the vaccine. There were some locals with cknpx posted last spring but it was right before contests our dc had spent months preparing for so I didn’t persue it (should’ve). I don’t want to give her an unnecessary vaccine that was made just to line someone’s pockets (as opposed to tetanus which I do give – ugh), but it’s my understanding that if they get cknpx later it’s dangerous. She’s about at that age. Of course so many that are getting the vaccine will very likely get it later also, or continue with boosters. I think in one local school about 11 dc came down with it even though every one of them had been vaccinated.

    (sigh)
    Beth

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    4 Rachel April 18, 2010 at 5:20 am

    Beth-My husband and I have been thinking about vaccines for our son (15 months). When it comes to the chickenpox vaccine, we’ve decided that we’ll do it if he doesn’t have the chickenpox by the time he’s 13. My mother didn’t have them as a child, and wound up with shingles in high school instead. It did a lot of nerve damage to one side of her face, so to me the risk of shingles outweighs the risk of not vaccinating. But my preference is for my son to have chickenpox as a child and build his own immunity.

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    5 Laura April 18, 2010 at 6:46 pm

    My nephew had the chickenpox vaccine as a baby, and later got shingles.

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    6 Liz April 23, 2012 at 12:36 pm

    I see this comment is older, but I thought I’d throw in my two cents. I was vaccinated against chicken pox as a child, got it anyway when I was about 8 years old, AND got shingles when I was 31 years old. Vaccine or not, if you’re going to get it, you’re going to get it!

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    7 KitchenKop August 28, 2009 at 11:27 am

    Beth, I wonder about that very thing and hope someone else chimes in who knows more. I’m hoping our youngest *will* get it naturally, but if not, I’m not sure what to do.
    Thanks,
    Kelly

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    8 Tina December 5, 2012 at 2:50 pm

    Get other like-minded parents together and have someone inform you when their child contracts chickenpox. Bring your child for a visit so they might either catch it or build an immunity to it.

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    9 Jeanmarie August 28, 2009 at 2:20 pm

    Kelly, I’ll delve into this, thanks. FYI there is an excellent, balanced, in-depth article on vaccines in the (current) July-August issue of Mothering magazine. The writer interviewed people on all sides of this issue, more in the context of routine vaccination programs for children than the swine flu issue, but it’s one of the most thoughtful pieces I’ve seen on this topic. She doesn’t come to a blanket conclusion one way or the other but gives some very good points to think about when considering each vaccine individually. It’s really worth looking at, no matter what your take on the issue. I don’t know whether it’s available on their website or not but the magazine should still be on newsstands.
    Cheers,
    Jeanmarie

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    10 Cara August 28, 2009 at 3:04 pm

    Chickenpox- it’s my understanding that you can still get shingles (which can have complications) later in life, even if you have had chicken pox as a child. Also, when I was doing research it appeared that the chickenpox vaccine only provided immunity for a few years, so someone would need to get a ‘booster’ every few years of their life if they wanted to do it that way. I also remember reading that the whooping cough vaccine was only effective for one year, and we don’t get boosters for that every year. And one link real quick, because it’s so often said that ‘it’s been proven that autism isn’t caused by vaccines’. The study was flawed that they site.
    http://www.whale.to/vaccine/stott.pdf

    (Kelly, feel free to delete my comment if I’m coming across too bossy! Sorry! I’m just passionate about this stuff)

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    11 jon w August 28, 2009 at 4:50 pm

    Kelly,

    Can you elaborate on why the MSNBC article made you want to vomit? Did you feel the author misrepresented the research? Or that the research itself is bad? I won’t be getting a flu shot unless I see a lot more evidence that it works or that the new flu is bad; however I can’t find a problem with Medlock and Galvani’s basic epidemiological model, or with the report on it. They don’t attempt to address whether the new flu strain will become more virulent, or whether vaccination is too dangerous, only what would be the optimal way to distribute vaccines for best effect.

    From the abstract:
    “we determined optimal vaccine allocation for five outcome measures: deaths, infections, years of life lost, contingent valuation, and economic costs. We find that optimal vaccination is achieved by prioritization of schoolchildren and adults aged 30 to 39 years. Schoolchildren are most responsible for transmission, and their parents serve as bridges to the rest of the population.”

    As I’ve said before, reading your site has opened my eyes to the fact that vaccines make money just like any other drug, and so there is a conflict of interest when the same companies making money are also lobbying and funding research to support their product. But I just dont see that angle in this particular article.

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    12 Jen August 28, 2009 at 4:52 pm

    I recently saw an ad in a magazine for a vaccine for shingles!

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    13 KitchenKop August 28, 2009 at 7:56 pm

    Cara, bossy works for me. :)

    Jon, instead I should’ve said that it makes me want to FIGHT, because that’s what I’ll do if they try to give it to *my* school aged kids. I just see this push coming and my fear is that they’ll try to make it “mandatory”. That’s all.

    Kelly

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    14 Jeanmarie August 28, 2009 at 8:10 pm

    I don’t have a problem with there being a shingles vaccine; my elderly uncle had shingles before he died a few years ago and it was very painful and miserable for him. However, I strongly object to forced vaccinations, especially of children, especially for multiple vaccines at once, or for unproven ones like the proposed swine flu vaccine. I also object to the typical portrayal of people who question, merely question, vaccines in general or a particular vaccine, as being nutcases who reject all medicine etc. As the Mothering article points out, people who decline to get vaccinated or to vaccinate their children are more likely than average to be well educated, and their ranks include many doctors. There no doubt is misinformation about vaccines floating about, but it’s not all on one side.

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    15 Motherhen68 August 28, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    There is a vax for shingles as my mother’s received it. I swear, she hears out my arguments against vaxs, and she goes to the doctor and he pushes them, and she agrees. I should go WITH her to the doctor’s and fight them off LOL.

    This forced swine flu vax is freaking me out. My kids are in school this year and I’m very afraid they will give them the shot without my authorization. Swine flu was rampant here last spring and all I’ve been hearing about is “swine flu swine flu swine flu”. It’s ridiculous!

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    16 Beth August 28, 2009 at 9:50 pm

    When I saw a news article recently about the military preparing to assist the health officials with the swine flu vaccine administration I freaked out inside. I imagined the military dragging us to get the vaccine, lol. The implications of the matter are still freaky (I won’t get into that!) but I realized after reading another article later about where they will be distributing and have been having drills that they are anticipating mob-like behavior from people WANTING the vacs… So that’s fine with me; I’ll sit this one out!

    What I can see happening in the schools is that even if a parent has it written on the forms and the teacher/administration is respectful of that, in the chaos of the vaccine day a child might accidentally get put in line, get the shot, and later they would say, “Oops, sorry.” The child needs to also be aware and able to say “No shot, call me mom or dad.”

    Beth

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    17 Sara August 29, 2009 at 10:18 am

    I too, am disheartened at the lack of independent studies on the subject. I have heard so many conflicting opinions on the link between vaccines and autism. I have now heard that they’re thinking the link to the growing autism rate is due to more and more inductions using Pitocin due to the idea (have no idea how many if any studies have been done on this) that autistic kids seem to have a lower oxytocin level because of the over-exposure during labor. We personally have only given our kids the tetanus shot, and not until they turned 2. Personally, I think research and education are key to making any decision, whether it is to vaccinate or not, or whether to accept pitocin for non-medically necessary inductions. Again, I don’t remember where I read the info, but when I find it back, I’ll post it here for you to see.

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    18 hillary August 29, 2009 at 12:24 pm

    It’s such a tough and personal decision. I feel like I would have to dedicate my life to wading through the information and even then would I totally get it…I’m not sure.

    I’m relying more on intuition for these decisions. I read as much as I can handle and then take a deep breath. What feels right for my family, for my children.

    I do wish it was more black and white, but I also trust that this phase of humanity will unravel into a deeper understanding of health for future generations (if we ever do sort this out.)

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    19 KitchenKop August 29, 2009 at 2:52 pm

    Hillary,

    I couldn’t agree more, it is a VERY tough and very personal decision. My research often left me more confused than anything.

    Kelly

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    20 Ashley August 29, 2009 at 10:29 pm

    Kelly,
    I didn’t read all of the comments, but if you haven’t heard I wanted you to know. Matt Lauer is interviewing Dr. Wakefield. He is the doctor who found strains of the measles in the guts of 12 of his autistic patients. It is coming on Dateline tomorrow night 8/31/09 at 6:00 central time. I’m not 100% sure when my ds (5 yrs) bowel problems started, but I do remember somewhere around 12 months I had to carry extra pants with me everywhere we went. His stools were soooooo loose! At his 2 (thimersol) month and 4 (thimerosol) month shots in Africa his leg swelled, he wouldn’t let me touch anywhere near the shot wound, and he screamed high pitched squeals for about 8 hours. I also had 4 rhogam shots with thimerosol. I have had 2 girls here in America one didn’t have any reactions to vaccines. My third had high pitched squeals at her 4 month shots just like my ds. We stopped vaccinating at 6 months. Oldest child now has severe GI issues and is a little hyper boy with really bad handwriting…doing well in other areas. Girls are both doing fine. I have one friend who had a normal baby and the night of her 6 month shots started having seizures. She is now 4 years and has awful seizures that haven’t stopped and she has very little speech. The government said if they signed papers that they wouldn’t sue they would pay for medical treatment for the rest of her life. My heart goes out to that family!!! OOps didn’t mean to go on and on…although I could about this topic!! lol

    Ashley

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    21 Ashley August 29, 2009 at 10:36 pm

    I’ll add one more thing….my friend also had the rhogam shot and the flu shot while she was pregnant!! I’m so scared for the pregnant mama’s who will be talked into the swine flu shot by their docs!

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    22 KitchenKop August 30, 2009 at 10:04 am

    Ashley, that is SO sad. For your son, have you read the GAPS posts??
    http://kellythekitchenkop.com/2009/08/gut-health-101-6-questions-and-answers-about-a-strong-immune-system-and-the-gaps-diet.html

    Thanks for sharing your story!
    Kelly

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    23 Ashley August 30, 2009 at 4:06 pm

    Yes, Kelly…we had our ds on the gaps diet for 9 months. He did very well on it. We had to take him off b/c of transition. My husband won’t let me put him on it full time again b/c it’s too hard on our family. I think I might do GAPS part time. Right now I’m doing lots of broth and he takes really good probiotics, but I need to add in some coconut kefir as well.

    Thanks for all of your hard work on this blog…it has helped me sooo much!

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    24 Kyle August 30, 2009 at 5:44 pm

    Thank you so much for giving us this information. I don’t think I’ll let my kids get very many shots (maybe a few) when I actually have some kids. Hopefully by then, things will be better. I realized just recently that I don’t like to talk about things like this too, because I could be wrong, and I don’t want to be responsible for somebody getting a serious disease.

    Oh, and I thought I’d let you know, my brother died a couple weeks ago (he was 15, a few years younger than me, and my best friend). That really made me want to change things, to spread the truth about nutrition. They gave him so many pills, and while some pills might have helped, a lot of them seemed like they were well-let’s-see-what-this-pill-does pills. He never wanted to take those pills, or get shots, but he didn’t have much of a choice. He complained about them all the time. I think rejecting the pills was something is body was instinctively telling him. It made me sad when they put him on a non-fat diet, and everything they did was just against everything I’ve learned. But the doctors loved him too, they promised that they’d get him through this. They did their absolute best, and I can’t begrudge them for that. You believe in God, right? I do too, and I don’t know what I’d do if I thought his death was the end, but it’s not.

    Anyways, thanks for listening, and thank you so much for your site!

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    25 KitchenKop August 30, 2009 at 9:24 pm

    Hi Kyle,

    I am filled with sadness for you right now, but at the same time I’m in awe of your beautiful faith, and your rock solid belief that you will see your brother again. You surely will, and right now he must be so proud of you and your amazing attitude. I’m sure you are right – that the docs only wanted to help him, but yes it’s so sad that they just don’t know about real food yet – but your blog, mine and others will keep doing what we can.

    I’m glad to know you’re a believer, and that you will lean on Jesus to help you through the grief process. When my Dad died, I learned that grief is a strange beast…you never know when it will hit you full force – every day is different.

    Hang in there, and I’ll be praying for you.

    Kelly p.s. Thank you for telling me. I feel like I know you from all your comments in the past months! :)

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    26 Kyle August 31, 2009 at 1:33 pm

    Thanks so much Kelly, again, you’re completely right :)

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    27 Darcie October 7, 2009 at 2:54 pm

    Hi Kelly –
    I just came across your site the other day when searching for a healthy hot chocolate recipe for my 3 boys. Thank you sooo much for all the research you do. I am 13 weeks pregnant with our 4th child and have been convinced that I wouldn’t get the H1N1 vaccination under any circumstance. However, it IS concerning to know that pregnant women are dying at a rate of 6x higher than others getting the swine flu. Do you have thoughts about why that is? I take a probiotic from Dr. Mercola every day, we take echinacea and elderberry. Any other things you think I should do to defend myself this fall/winter?
    Thanks!!!!

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    28 Jeanmarie October 7, 2009 at 4:18 pm

    Darcie, add fermented cod liver oil to your daily regimen. Most of us are short on A and D, which fight infections and cancer respectively and are so important for the immune system. You can get FCLO at http://www.drrons.com/ or http://www.greenpasture.org/.

    I just made a pot of garlic soup with homemade chicken stock to help me get over a lingering “almost sore” throat. That should help with anything!
    Cheers,
    Jeanmarie

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    29 KitchenKop October 7, 2009 at 9:49 pm

    Darcie, good advice from Jeanmarie, and you can look through more immune building suggestions here: http://kellythekitchenkop.com/category/immune-system-building

    Sorry, I haven’t looked into the issue of pregnant women being in a higher risk group, but I’d be very nervous getting a shot of anything while pregnant, not knowing how it could affect the baby.

    Kelly

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    30 Beth October 7, 2009 at 11:10 pm

    Darcie,

    I heard on the news (briefly) that it had to do with the pressure on the lungs from the baby but I haven’t looked into it further. I just googled and found this quote from a mainstream media (CNN) article:

    “Still, the apparent disproportionate impact of H1N1 on pregnant women is not surprising, given the body changes that occur during pregnancy, she said.

    “As the uterus grows and pushes the diaphragm up, there is less room for the lungs,” affecting a woman’s ability to breathe, she said.

    Pregnancy’s impact goes beyond structural; it affects the body’s ability to fight off illness, she said.

    “A pregnant woman has to accommodate this foreign body of the growing fetus, so there is an immunological shift that occurs in pregnancy,” she said.

    Don’t know if that helps or not.
    Beth

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    31 Rebekah November 17, 2009 at 5:45 pm

    Kelly,

    I am a little more than 6 months pregnant with our first baby. I have just started doing a little research about vaccines. Any chance your post about which vaccines you opted for and against will be forthcoming soon? I know it’s a personal decision but it would be sooooo helpful to have guidance from some other mothers who have already walked this road!

    Thanks!
    Rebekah

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    32 Kelly the Kitchen Kop November 17, 2009 at 8:28 pm

    Rebekah, congratulations!
    I’ll try to move that one up the list and get it done in the next two or three weeks. Once I post, hopefully it will spark a lot of good conversation that will be helpful for you. In the meantime, do some Googling! :)
    Kelly

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    33 margaret parker October 8, 2010 at 6:09 pm

    i was a pediatric nurse for 7 years and it scared the boogers out of me everytime i gave the immunizations to children….worse yet, i moved to a medicaid funded health provider and it was the nurses job to decide which shot was needed…these childrens care was so fragmented and the parents so unknowing , i feared…what if they are not remembering where some of these shots were given and i am doubling up on them?…myself, i now work with severely disabled, both physically and mentally challenged individuals, immuno suppressed, catch everything and i wouldnt dare take a flu shot due to the components…the doc is forever yelling at me as i have cardiac issues and asthma but you know what..bet my immune just fine :)

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    34 KP August 23, 2011 at 10:06 am

    My children were born before my “food conversion”. As a matter of fact, my children were the impetus for my “food conversion”.

    I will make a very long story as brief as possible. My first baby was born with severe reflux and other digestive issues. The medication the doctors put him on led to slimy green stool. Long term slimy green stool. I struggled with this. I struggled with doctors telling me what to do and doctors not listening to what I had to say. I did lots and lots of research and still doctors didn’t listen. I switched pediatricians 8 times in my baby’s first year. I went to 3 different children’s hospitals, trying to find someone who would listen and would help my suffering baby. I am sure somewhere on my son’s medical charts is a notation that I was difficult or neurotic. But my diligence and research finally paid off and I eventually discovered the link to food and my child’s problems, and against doctor’s opinions was able to overcome his health problems and get him off all meds by switching to real food.

    But what does this have to do with vaccinations. Well, while were still in the midst of the conventional medicine and standard diet, my baby was 3 months old and due for vaccinations. At the time, the Rotavirus vaccine was approved for use. I was questioning vaccinations but so far in my baby’s life, I allowed the doc to give my baby all the vacs recommended and “required.” However, this one was different. The Rotavirus vaccine was new. New worried me. Also, one of the side effects was actually getting rotavirus, albeit a milder version. The Rotavirus caused gastrointestinal (GI) issues, mainly diarrhea. My baby already had GI issues, so I thought it would be a good thing not to get this vaccine and assault my baby’s already stressed GI system. I told the nurse and doc to go ahead with the other 3 vacs but to skip the Rotavirus vaccine. They tried to convince me that it was perfectly safe and I had nothing to worry about. As I held my helpless 3 month old baby, they started administering the shots, . . . one . . . . two . . . three . . . and now the nurse approaches with #4. What? Wait? Why are there four? She said that she went ahead and gave my baby the Rotavirus vaccine because I was being ridiculous and over-reacting about vaccines. The first shot, that she had already given him, was the Rotavirus vaccine. WHAT?! She went against my wishes. I was so mad. But what could I do?

    It gets worse. That evening my baby spiked a 105 fever and had PROJECTILE diarrhea. Lots and lots of diarrhea. My poor, sweet little baby. I took him back to the doctor first thing in the morning — I was worried, scared, upset. The nurse again treated me like I was over-reacting and said not to worry, that it was a common side effect of the vaccine to get sick and that he probably would have been a lot worse if we had not gotten the vaccine. I don’t think so. How do you know if something would have been worse if that experience can never happen to compare? He may never have even contracted the disease. I switched peds that day and never returned to that doctor’s office.

    Well the worst was yet to come. Less than 3 months later the vaccine was taken off the market because it was shown to cause intestinal damage in infants. As far as I know, my son never suffered permanent damage, but how do I really know what it going on inside his intestines? At least it wasn’t the life threatening stuff the vaccine had caused in other babies. If there is damage in my son it is unknown and unseen. The only known is that he suffered 3 days of violent diarrhea. We also continued to deal with severe GI issues and multiple visits to GI specialists and all other kinds of doctors for 4 more years, until I discovered the importance of real food. BUT, the fact that the doctor and nurse tried to convince me of this new vaccine’s safety and then covertly forced my son to get the vaccine is . . . is . . . I cannot even find the words to describe it accurately. Perhaps, abusive.

    The thing that scares me most if that most parents blindly follow their doctor’s recommendations. Never questioning. I know that most doctors are good people, doing the best they can with the information they are taught. But they are not perfect.

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    35 Kelly the Kitchen Kop August 23, 2011 at 6:20 pm

    I am positively speechless. I can’t imagine how you must’ve felt!??!!

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    36 KP August 23, 2011 at 6:40 pm

    Sad, angry, outraged, stunned, exhausted. I probably felt a few other emotions, too. More than 12 years later, I am still upset that my wishes were outright ignored. And I wonder how many of his subsequent GI problems could have been avoided or at least lessened. My baby had a very rough first year of life.

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    37 Kris April 23, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    They cannot administer vaccinations without your permission. There should be some sort of recourse for something like that.

    Horrifying

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    38 KP August 23, 2011 at 10:25 am

    FYI, the damage caused by the 1999 version of the Rotavirus vaccine was:

    Intussusception is a problem with the intestine in which one portion of the bowel slides into the next, much like the pieces of a telescope.

    http://www.cdc.gov/Mmwr/PDF/wk/mm4827.pdf

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    39 Fonda LaShay November 30, 2011 at 8:08 am

    I would love to see a ”running” list of which you have allowed for your children and your reasoning with each. I looked around abit and did not see such a post – correct me if I am wrong.

    I dont have kids yet, but plan too. I am an American living in Norway and happy to report that there are only 10 recommended childhood vaccinations – I am still researching if any are mandatory.

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    40 KitchenKop November 30, 2011 at 8:15 am

    Hi Fonda,

    I don’t have anything listed out, but what we did is explained in the first two links above.

    Great job looking into all of this *before* having kids, because it takes a lot of time!

    Kelly

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    41 Fonda LaShay November 30, 2011 at 9:30 am

    Thanks for the quick reply. I am reading through them now.

    I just found out that there are no mandatory vaccinations in Norway, I am rather excited about this!

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    42 Linh April 23, 2012 at 5:03 am

    Jenny McCarthy, 1993 Playmate of the Year, noted anti-vaccination activist vs. thousands of scientists who do actual, original, and peer-reviewed research on vaccines.

    Jenny McCarthy wins? What’s wrong with you people?

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    43 dani April 23, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    You shouldn’t knock someone just because they’re a playmate, it doesn’t mean she’s unintelligent. And majority of those studies are not independent, and have financial backing from the very vaccination companies they are studying. Also, she cured her kid of autism, which is an amazing feat in itself but also goes to show that alternative methods are often the right methods.

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    44 Stuart April 23, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    So, you would rather believe a paranoid conspiracy theory about vaccines that was based on a debunked study that was paid for by lawyers looking to sue vaccine producing companies instead of believing peer-reviewed science *facts* based on herd immunity?

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    45 Jen April 23, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    Most of the people I know that do vaccine have spent very little time researching it. Most of the people I know that don’t vaccine have spent hours and hours and hours researching their decision. That face that the government has acknowledged vaccine injury with a specific court just for vaccine injury should give you a clue that there’s something to this “paranoid conspiracy”.

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    46 Rachel B. April 23, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    Really? You think this is all based on the opinions of Jenny McCarthy? The anti-vaccination movement started long before she got involved. And how is her past employment relevant to her ability to do her own research? The problem is not with any of us, but with people like you who refuse to do any research of your own, but take research done by doctors and scientists (who have vested interest in specific results from that research) as 100% fact. *applause*

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    47 Stuart April 23, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    the autism study that has been completely debunked, is that what you are referring to? The one that was paid for by lawyers looking for a way to sue vaccine producing companies? Is that what you mean?

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    48 Kris April 23, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    This is about much more than autism. Vaccines can cause all kinds of problems.

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    49 ah April 23, 2012 at 12:24 pm

    Stuart,

    You should do some research rather then relying soley on what is dubbed as ‘science’ or *facts* that you get on Fox news, or even what your doctor regurgitates from the pharmaceutical company. This has nothing to do with Jenny McCarthy and everything to do with pure research and the wisdom of parents who care about their childrens welfare above anything else…

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    50 EllaJac April 23, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    I don’t have any idea who Jenny McCarthy is. I do have children though, and the vaccine issue has been a big one for me for some time. I’ve read and read about the subject, and no one I’ve seen has referenced or quoted any playboy models. Maybe we could just debate with relevant information?

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    51 Linh April 24, 2012 at 8:49 pm

    Okay, before you assume I’ve done no research (i.e. “government regurgitated “) yes, I have, probably spent hours making sure benefits outweighed costs on vaccines. I know McCarthy doesn’t represent the whole issue. I just think that you all put too much weight on statements by those who aren’t really in a position to make those sort of statements. Generally, it starts with a study vaguely show a possible link between a certain vaccine and a disease or disorder of some sort. The media then plays it up for all it’s worth. Vaccination rates lower, preventable deaths by disease rise. This cycle has repeated itself since smallpox.

    Sightly unrelated, does anyone not believe in global warming/climate change?

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    52 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 11:55 am

    I’m sure you’d rather I didn’t. lol

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    53 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    If you’re so sure about your stance why not do it yourself instead of sicking your followers in it. I mean it’s your blog after all. If I wanted to argue with people online I’d start y own vaccine blog.

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    54 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    Well, I am pretty sure that Jenny McCarthy is not anti-vaccine. Doesn’t she want to Green Our Vaccines?

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    55 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:03 pm

    Well I have a bachelors degree, and an MBA (so does my husband) so I feel that we are intelligent enough to make our own decision as to what goes into our kids’ bodies. I frankly don’t care one way or another what others choose to do. It’s a choice and everyone is entitled to do what they feel is right. It’s all about making an INFORMED decision, which I feel we did after hours and hours of reading/research.

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    56 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Which comment is it? I might be goofy, but is it still the last comment?

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    57 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    I have quit engaging this type of person in dialogue. They are closed minded and they would rather believe the government propaganda than a person who has spent painstaking hours and hours researching and educating themselves on the pros and cons of vaccines. It is easier for them to assume we are ignorant folks than to hear the painful truths.

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    58 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    funny..just talking about this because of something I posted on my wall. They are asking me the same “what makes me the health expert?”

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    59 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 12:42 pm

    I just try to remember how bought in I was to vaccinating my children before I made the choice to stop. It requires a different way of looking at our health. It breaks my heart to think of the damage I may have already done (decision was made when my last was 1 1/2) and the damage those who are close to me may be doing. I try not to make other’s feel bad for their choices and ask the same from them.

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    60 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 1:08 pm

    I’m not anti-vaccine, but I am anti “over-vaccine”, and I also don’t want vaccines that are acquired in an unethical manner. I just found out recently that there are some vaccines that use aborted fetal cells to make the vaccines.

    http://www.cogforlife.org/vaccineinfo.htm

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    61 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 1:11 pm

    already went there face to face a week ago….no thanks!!! oh, well, maybe….!

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    62 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 1:14 pm

    The orginal idea of a vaccine (as I understand it) was to take a dead virus, or almost dead virus and inject it into the body so the white blood cells can finish it off/ get rid of it. Which taught the white blood cells how to handle it in the future, should the person ever encounter it again. **It didn’t guarantee that the person would never contract the illness** My problem is that when they began to be massed produced the vaccine companies had to find a way to make them shelf stable, so they started adding chemicals into them. These chemicals in no way made the vaccine better, just last longer after manufacturing. Unfortunately many of these chemicals are toxic to our bodies, expecially to children because their system can’t handle them. What really peeves me is the lobbiests in the gov’t have people believing that it is safe and those that choose not to get them are subversive and putting others at risk.

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    63 Elizabeth H. April 23, 2012 at 1:29 pm

    I don’t know if anyone else already mentioned this or not, but the MSNBC link and the Newsmax link aren’t correct. They just link back to the homepage of those sites and not the specific articles you wanted them to direct us to.

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    64 Marissa April 23, 2012 at 2:03 pm

    Preaching to the choir: We stopped vaccination at 12 months because my daughter had some “minor” health issues, vaginal yeast and some skin problems. My decision not to continue vaccinating was because I knew that it would hurt her gut/immune system adding insult to injury. When her stool and urine tests come back normal, we will consider giving her “safe” shots. Call us ignorant and uneducated, but my husband and I look at it like this: Contracting a disease from not vaccinating is better than giving (us and) our child a crappy quality of life. Modern medical doctors are great at keeping people “alive”, but suck at ensuring quality-of-life. It’s a better gamble IMO to recover (or die from) from a contracted virus than to suffer lifelong from a psychological disorder. We call this “risking with wisdom”.

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    65 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 2:13 pm

    I agree with Angie. My husband and I researched and studied every book and article we could find in addition to interviewing countless health professionals and parents before making an intelligent decision. We also have two bachelor’s and one master’s degree between us. Yet, the unstudied who blindly follow “doctor’s orders” are considered the intelligent, responsible ones.

    I also agree with Bethany. The original idea was sound, and similar to homeopathy (“like cures like”). However, just as with wheat, corn, and other originally good food, all the ways we have messed with it (pesticides, GMOs, etc.) have now made these foods dangerous for many to ingest. A better alternative is to get homeopathic vaccines, which are completely safe.

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    66 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 3:36 pm

    Angie Carswell said it best!

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    67 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 10:33 pm

    Thank you Angie Carwell!!

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    68 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 11:16 pm

    Thank you all for your help! (Most of you anyway.) I’m just now getting back to reading these after a crazy busy day.

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    69 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 23, 2012 at 11:50 pm

    All I know is, my niece is a pediatrician, and she says she has watched infants (plural) die, die for want of a flu vaccination. And she practices in a wealthy area.

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    70 %kelly the kitchen kop% via Facebook April 28, 2012 at 8:48 pm

    I have had measles 2 times yes same kind have had the shot 6 times still showing no immunity to it am done no more shots period. Of any kind

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    71 Lindsay Leigh Bentley January 25, 2013 at 2:47 pm

    Thank you for this info! The vaccine debate can become so emotional, which is where I usually check out. My readers ask almost daily for my view on vaccines and I haven’t had the time (or guts) to write out a post (or twelve) on the topic, so I am sharing yours with them! Great honest info!

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    72 Linda Cowan Muse via Facebook September 22, 2014 at 7:01 pm

    Here is a link I saw today on my niece’s fb page. Don’t know if it’s one that’s already made the rounds but I thought it was very good. http://vactruth.com/2014/09/07/informed-parents-vaccine-exemption/

    Reply

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